New Unity ruleset - Needs to be stickied due to constant updates

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#21
1:55 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
xzx
Picture Perfect
Joined: Aug 2009
xzx won a Screenshot of the Week Contest!xzx contributed to the Stadium community.

Lol Jungle Japes.
#22
3:43 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
falln
Apathetic
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Quote (originally posted by Red Ryu):
Ok, well useful then yeah, fair is all he's got for planking.

Again the point being, do we really need a LGL on characters like him, or Zelda, or Link?

There are very few characters who can plank effectively.


its less on the character that's planking and more on who you're planking

almost every character in the game can successfully plank falco
#23
4:59 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
-LzR-
Host
Joined: Dec 2009

Quote (originally posted by xzx):
Lol Jungle Japes.


Now what the hell is wrong with that stage?
Don't tell "random klap trap", please don't tell me...
Quote (originally posted by xzx):
I thought you knew better. You're a MK main after all. I know more about MK than you, lol. SL actually gives that knockback, you can't DI upwards. It gives that gay knockback. Have you ever got hit by that? In that case, the Wario couldn't DI, because it gives that kind of knockback. Facepalm at you, -LzR-.
#24
5:41 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
The Cadet
Addicted to Wifi
Joined: Sep 2009
The Cadet impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

Quote (originally posted by Darknid):
Cadet: Neither Japes nor Picto should be legal. Picto has random game-changing hazards and Japes is broken for ahem, some characters... DK, for instance, can camp in the water on the left side using his Swimming Kong trick and this protects him from most characters. It isn't technically stalling, either, because your opponent can hit you; they will most likely die, but they can hit you.


I've heard a lot about this... Got any vids? Not that I have serious doubts, it's just good practice to ask for vids.

EDIT: @Falln: while that pont about falco is technically true, it is very telling-we have a character with a very serious and definite weakness, but we prop him up for what reason? If my ganon can plank falco and win, why is this a bad thing? Falco is being propped up as a character by this. By like, a lot. I mean, it's one thing if it's super broken and over half the cast can't deal with it (DK/MK)... But one or two characters that flat-out die to planking? That's a character weakness. And oddly enough, falco is one of the best-equipped characters to bypass with this particular weakness with both a very strong and damaging camping game involving projectiles and an easy way to rack up a lot of damage at the beginning of each stock. If I didn't know sakurai better, I'd think that this was intentional... It's like complaining about how easy it is to gimp olimar... Sure, that's a character weakness of his, but good olimars don't get gimped. Good falcos don't lose the lead easily.
Scrub: Person who does not play to win
Noob: Person who does not play well enough to win
There's a difference. Figure out it.
Last edited by The Cadet, 11:45 AM on Apr 08, 2011
#25
8:07 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
Volke Aeno
Defender
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Quote (originally posted by The Cadet):
And oddly enough, falco is one of the best-equipped characters to deal with this particular weakness with both a very strong and damaging camping game involving projectiles and an easy way to rack up a lot of damage at the beginning of each stock. If I didn't know sakurai better, I'd think that this was intentional...


When you say "dealing with this weakness [planking]," it kinda makes it sound like he can deal with someone already planking (Which I'm pretty sure you're not meaning that). Someone not paying close attention might miss what you mean.

I would think that bypassing the weakness would be the better way to say it, since Falco's easy stock lead prevents people from legally exploiting that weakness.

10/10 moderating skills.
#26
9:13 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
xzx
Picture Perfect
Joined: Aug 2009
xzx won a Screenshot of the Week Contest!xzx contributed to the Stadium community.

Quote (originally posted by -LzR-):
Now what the hell is wrong with that stage?
Don't tell "random klap trap", please don't tell me...
No, of course not, and we have discussed this stage on a chat. It is the damn river, seriously.
#27
11:45 AM Apr 8 2011 2011
The Cadet
Addicted to Wifi
Joined: Sep 2009
The Cadet impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

The river? What about it? Please tell me you're not having trouble recovering out of it...
#28
1:47 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
Phil Nye the SCIENCE Guy
Tons of Damage
Joined: May 2008
Phil Nye the SCIENCE Guy is a troll. Please ignore anything said by this user.
"Troll"

I thought the reason that MK/Wario/Sonic circle camp pretty well on that stage made good enough grounds for Japes, plus the people who are good at camping/control do really well on this stage (like Falco and Olimar iirc)
#29
2:25 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
falln
Apathetic
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Quote (originally posted by The Cadet):
EDIT: @Falln: while that pont about falco is technically true, it is very telling-we have a character with a very serious and definite weakness, but we prop him up for what reason? If my ganon can plank falco and win, why is this a bad thing? Falco is being propped up as a character by this. By like, a lot. I mean, it's one thing if it's super broken and over half the cast can't deal with it (DK/MK)... But one or two characters that flat-out die to planking? That's a character weakness. And oddly enough, falco is one of the best-equipped characters to bypass with this particular weakness with both a very strong and damaging camping game involving projectiles and an easy way to rack up a lot of damage at the beginning of each stock. If I didn't know sakurai better, I'd think that this was intentional... It's like complaining about how easy it is to gimp olimar... Sure, that's a character weakness of his, but good olimars don't get gimped. Good falcos don't lose the lead easily.


so pretty much falco's solution to not get planked is to pretty much never lose the lead ever or else he becomes worthless. That's not a weakness; that's a game flaw. A weakness is Olimar's difficulty in recovering, because the player can reasonably manage the issue and compensate for it in other ways. A game flaw is like dedede vs dk or, say, anyone who wants to plank vs falco. We're not propping falco up by enforcing lgl; we're keeping him viable. Just like you need dededes infinite to be banned for dk to be viable at all (which lmao isn't banned because of how horrible this ruleset is).

i'm very tempted to mm larry next time i can and plank the **** out of him with kirby and then very happily send you the video. The solution to everything isn't "hurr durr good falcos dont lose the lead"


also as a closing note planking in general stales the game by inhibiting metagame progression by shifting the focus from actually playing to "oh just get a lead for a few minutes then plank the last 3 minutes off the timer". it also turns away people who come to tournaments and want to get into the game competitively if all they see when they enter is richbrown v will. Ignore "theoretical brawl" for just a little bit and look at the effect planking has on the community and no reasonable person can say that it can continue in its current state
#30
2:32 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
The Cadet
Addicted to Wifi
Joined: Sep 2009
The Cadet impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

Quote (originally posted by falln):
so pretty much falco's solution to not get planked is to pretty much never lose the lead ever or else he becomes worthless. That's not a weakness; that's a game flaw. A weakness is Olimar's difficulty in recovering, because the player can reasonably manage the issue and compensate for it in other ways. A game flaw is like dedede vs dk or, say, anyone who wants to plank vs falco. We're not propping falco up by enforcing lgl; we're keeping him viable. Just like you need dededes infinite to be banned for dk to be viable at all (which lmao isn't banned because of how horrible this ruleset is).


That sounds like a very, very arbitrary distinction... Like, seriously, it's really arbitrary. Is Ganon's complete inability to deal with spotdodging/powershielding a character weakness or a game flaw? What about Zelda's inability to approach? Link's recovery? I can keep going...

Quote:
i'm very tempted to mm larry next time i can and plank the **** out of him with kirby and then very happily send you the video. The solution to everything isn't "hurr durr good falcos dont lose the lead"


Even if that's not a reasonable solution, guess what: we don't arbitrarily buff characters. Falco fails completely at the ledge? Oh well. Ganon fails completely everywhere. Planking is a major game-changer for falco, because it turns a top tier character into a character who is still solid, but just incredibly hard to play effectively.


Quote:
also as a closing note planking in general stales the game by inhibiting metagame progression by shifting the focus from actually playing to "oh just get a lead for a few minutes then plank the last 3 minutes off the timer". it also turns away people who come to tournaments and want to get into the game competitively if all they see when they enter is richbrown v will. Ignore "theoretical brawl" for just a little bit and look at the effect planking has on the community and no reasonable person can say that it can continue in its current state


Fair enough. This I'll give you. I just wanted to point out how global LGLs prop up "bad" characters.
Scrub: Person who does not play to win
Noob: Person who does not play well enough to win
There's a difference. Figure out it.
#31
2:58 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
xzx
Picture Perfect
Joined: Aug 2009
xzx won a Screenshot of the Week Contest!xzx contributed to the Stadium community.

Lol JJ got huge problems. The river mess it up for many characters, and it is too big and is too OP for campers.
#32
3:11 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
The Cadet
Addicted to Wifi
Joined: Sep 2009
The Cadet impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

Quote (originally posted by xzx):
Lol JJ got huge problems. The river mess it up for many characters


IIRC there are... 3? characters who cannot recover if they fall in the water from the left-most platform. If that many.

Quote:
and it is too big and is too OP for campers.


Citation needed.
Scrub: Person who does not play to win
Noob: Person who does not play well enough to win
There's a difference. Figure out it.
#33
4:17 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
Eternal Mangekyo Zebra
Sage
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Eternal Mangekyo Zebra impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

As i see it we have no stages as of now that have a walkoff or a place where you can't die off the bottom *you still can in japes but it's situational*.

Having a walkoff *or in this case runoff HAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAH GET IT?* on any legal stage for more than about 15 seconds seems to be a turn off for our community.
#34
10:50 PM Apr 8 2011 2011
GAY
Smart
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GAY impressed a staff member by doing something smart.GAY has an eye for classic game sprites and a head for modern gaming's legacy.

I wish Japes was legal, I'm really good on that stage. :<
#35
12:10 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
BFAA Inui
In the Spotlight
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I went to Cadet's profile to see his tournament records.

I saw nothing.

LOL

**** GAY ON JAPES ROFL JHFD.KJHVLKF.HDJKVHRFJKGVFHDSL
#36
1:50 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
san
Broken Ladder
Joined: Oct 2008

Japes is our the nice. Picto is our the suck.
#37
4:10 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
The Cadet
Addicted to Wifi
Joined: Sep 2009
The Cadet impressed a staff member by doing something smart.

Quote (originally posted by Inui):
I went to Cadet's profile to see his tournament records.

I saw nothing.

LOL

**** GAY ON JAPES ROFL JHFD.KJHVLKF.HDJKVHRFJKGVFHDSL


**** off Inui; not only does this have nothing to do with the discussion at hand, but I actually have some decent results. I'm not some random in my region. I'm also not sure as to how to update that at all; I don't think the german TOs advertise on AiB. 

Also, yeah, still hoping for some vids... Anyone got 'em?

FOR THE RECORD: I hate Japes. I played a round or two against Ravenlord's Lucas on that stage... Not fun, lemme tell ya. Falco is a huge pain in the *** as well. But until I figure out what's banworthy about it, I'm going to reserve snap judgment. That's how you get retards banning stages like PS2 and RC.
Scrub: Person who does not play to win
Noob: Person who does not play well enough to win
There's a difference. Figure out it.
Last edited by The Cadet, 4:29 AM on Apr 09, 2011
#38
5:50 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
-LzR-
Host
Joined: Dec 2009

I don't see anything bad about Japes. It's pretty effective for camping, but it's not broken. The high ceiling makes vertical killmoves weaker. Too bad if you are Fox or something.
The water doesn't kill like what, any character unless you suck...
The Klap Trap is simple to avoid if you are able to focus, but if you lose your focus, the Klap Trap sez hi, but that's your own fault or the opponent tricked you.
I don't really see how Falco is THAT good there. If you have the lead, you can camp in the middle yourself making it harder for Falco to camp himself.

I think MK is crazy on this stage though. So don't cp this against him, ever. icon_biggrin
#39
6:03 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
xzx
Picture Perfect
Joined: Aug 2009
xzx won a Screenshot of the Week Contest!xzx contributed to the Stadium community.

JJ is still retarded. Seriously, the river isn't fair. And NO, I don't complain about the Klap Trap. I complain about the stupid river. If I get down in the water, I don't want to suffer from about 1sec of lag before I can do anything, it is too long and messes up so much! >.>
#40
6:41 AM Apr 9 2011 2011
-LzR-
Host
Joined: Dec 2009

You must get trolling or you must be stupid. The water saves lifes more than it kills. Learn to not die ok?
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