I think maximum range dtilt is safe on Dedede's shield.

next discussion wario lolimar and ice climbersss
my predictions
wario- 50/50 i disagree with ppl saying its in his favor
olimar- 60/40- olimar
ice climbers- 70/30 icies >_< but its in our favor if we go zelda ^_^

lol......again busy. Things have been piling up on me.

TL I wanna say Even 50:50. We can just get in so well with simple dashing shield. No reason he should be camping us so hard lol. Just gotta watch out for other setups that he may be trying to lure you into.
G&W: Slightly for him, 55:45 G&W. Yea he has all the power in the world but it's all telegraphed so as long as we remain mobile and even camp needles a bit, we can score early kills with DACUS.
ZSS: Everything has been said pretty much. I'll say even for this.

Wario: 55:45 Us or Even. Convince me how we lose this one.
Olimar: I feel like this one is slightly for Olimar but not too much. I was lucky to play Brood in tourney at Apex and I lost 2-1. This one is all momentum based. Whoever has it last will win lol.
ICs: Ummmmm.....65:35 for ICs. I think this ratio is going to steadily improve and that's my gut feeling. The only real big problem is that it is hard to be safe on shield for an entire match so it'll eventually get us.

Also: Nowadays, Zelda loses to ICs worse than us so she isn't really the best option anymore. Trust me.

It's not that easy for Zelda, bad ICs are usually prone to getting Din's camped more often esp. if they don't know the MU and desynch from a far distance, but good ICs can deal with din's pretty well, and then get in hard (or outspace smashes w/ blizzard). I'm not sure about it being worse than sheik, but it's not exactly an advantage for her.

Sheik is harder mainly because almost NOTHING is safe, it's really dumb lol. If you get a seperation, you can air release -> DACUS guaranteed on Popo, although if Popo grabs you he has a dthrow CG until like 80% lol

Wario I think is even.

I think it's 60:40 Olimar, I'm not quite convinced it's near even, we may have that really broke chain trap that works on him, but Olimar's really powerful as a whole. I think if Olimar didn't have the damage racking potential he did (esp. with those low % CG/throw strings), and the obviously strong KO power, It would probably be more even. My opinion is that his ground game is just a tad too beefy against us to be close, but it's very winnable.

Wario is 55:45 us in my opinion, we have a guaranteed kill on him with Grab Release, and he's pretty easy to get in on, he has no projectile, don't fall into his traps, and it's leaning more towards us. He can kill early though.

Olimar: 40/60 I hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, this matchup. I have so much trouble with it, Olimar never has to approach, ever. If he approaches, he's doing it wrong. You have to approach him, if you hit his shield, you're grabbed or punished easily. I guess needle and chain camping work against him, but it is so annoying to play in my opinion.

ICs: 30/70 I can't play this MU, at all. I'd rather not use Sheik for this MU period.

alrighty this was pretty simple and straightforward!
Wario 55/45 us
Oli 60/40 him
Climb 70/30 them cant see it any better at the moment but i see it having potential to improve

Alrighty guys time for our most likely favorite matchup discussions.... Marth and Falco... (this should be interesting)

Marth- 55/45 for him (id say even if it wasn't for dolphin)
Falco- 45/55 Sheik... omg our favor against a top tier?!?!?! We can live through cg to spike now adays thanks to SDI Also see fox tutourial (ftilit ftilit ftlit win!)

I used to love fighting Marths, was one of my favorite MUs, Marth has a grab->grab->spike on us from 0. You can choose to camp him with needles, and just power shield the **** out of his moves and punish. But he can do the same, plus he kills easily. If you get inside of his tipper range then you're in a good spot, never be "close" to it, either far away, or inside.

I think Falco is very even, and as long as neither puts it as 60:40 their favor or more, I'm fine with whatever ratio. It's super even, just watch BluB v. Biggad.

Marth I think is 60:40 Marth's favor at least (unless it's on a stage like FD or Halberd). Bad marths will SH double fair and you'll get a free dash attack, and they don't use DB against sheik. DB is like 60% of this MU for Marth, it's the best ground game Marth has besides grabs and oos options. If it's a good marth, you're going to have a hard time punishing him properly w/o needles. He also edgeguards us very hard lol, if the tipper bair is air dodged, he has enough time to fair you while you're still stuck in your air dodge lol.  Powershielding means he's not mixing up his aerial timings, or not using nair as much, it's very easy to avoid the powershield if you do empty hops, FF fairs, SH ADs, nairs, crossup uairs, etc.

And yes, his DS is quite annoying, just make sure to mix up your options as much as possible, use less jab mixups if you're getting DS'd from jab jab -> grab or things like that lol. It's a fun-ish MU, but I think it's arguably one of our hardest non-CG MUs.

Playing MikeHAZE really changed my opinion on what defines marth, and we have a really good one up here in my region (Bladewise), who actually placed decently in doubles with Marth.  It's still winnable, but imo it's very stage dependent, don't take him to BF, SV, Frigate, or Yoshi's Island imo.  If you can, take him to Halberd, FD, PS1, and depending on your playstyle and comfort level with the stage, Castle Siege (it's actually a pretty debatable stage as to whether it's better for sheik or marth, but I think the staling statues ftilt gimmick + 3rd transformation is helpful to sheik overall).

I think Marth is 60/40 Marth's favor, no more and no less.

Falco is even.

I hope none of you have been getting KO'd by any sort of throw-to-spike combo, seeing as how Sheik's recovery has more than enough distance to make it back to the stage with a meteor cancel.

You can also SDI the dair onto the stage to survive, unless they space their throw so that they get you all the way offstage lol

If you take marth to Castle Seige, stay away from the sides on the 2nd transformation at low % or else it's cya stock.

Staying by the sides on the second transformation at any time in any match-up is usually pretty dangerous to begin with.

Yeah, conversely it can also help our relative kill problems if we straddle the sides. Imo, if you have a better handle over your opponent's playstyle and habits, I say you should use the sides to your advantage. If he's adapting or he's learning yours, you might want to think twice.

Both characters have good "chase" throws, even though they don't combo, they might as well since it puts the opponent in a really bad position most of the time, so either character can do a fthrow/bthrow -> aerial and get a quick stock on this stage.

btw, on the first transformation, there's walls underneath the stage, so you can wallcling to add a little more depth to your recovery. Also, the left lower dip is probably the best place to be on the first transformation 90% of the time, it's really hard to approach someone who knows how to play on that stage on that side, because it's pretty difficult to approach that place (although needles aren't as effective because of the rise), because aerials now go about a full hop above your head instead of a normal SH, the platform kinda helps cover crossups, and other campers have a hard time usually getting their projectiles to effectively pressure someone in that dip.

Alrighty guysss were almost donee
any last opinions on these two before the last discussion???
Alsoo on a side notee
I'll have a surprise once were done =)

Nope /bump

Ummmm....Marth isn't too bad. It honestly all depends on how their style is against you. Aggro Marth is simple but campy Marth SUCKS so much. I can see this being only a +1 against us. At absolute worst, 60:40 Marth. Gimping Marth is actually kinda scary because he can turn the tables really fast on us with DB1 traps.

Falco, again is all relative to styles. Aggro Falco should be our favor for sure +1. Camp Falco is even because we have great counter camp options and also have the tools to get in. Ftilt lock CAN net us a kill but it is tough to keep him in it for the whole time. His jab is obnoxious and he can actually out box us which is so lame. Ummm, if we play safe, we can live super long in this MU, but respect his aerials. They are so good! Aaaaaah!!!

Alrighty lasstt discussions! MK SNAKE AND DIDDY DUM DUM DUHH
My final predictions
Mk- 60/40 mk
Snake-55/45 snake (yes some ppl say its worse i disagree)
Diddy- 55/45 diddy just because most sheiks dont know the mu doesnt mean its unplayable i think we can definitely play and beat diddys

I agree with those, pretty straight-forward, although I think MK might be worse (maybe).

Might be a little worse than 60-40 for MK. It's worse than Marth, but better than Kirby imo.

Other two look good.