I've decided to start taking more command of this board and have changed this thread to a general ICs advice thread, so post away if you have questions!

Other stuff that was once supposed to go in here no longer need to.

-Mike (Nintendude1189)

Ok, lets starts to discuss about something that is really neccesary for any IC player to know in any matchup, grab setups. What leads to landing a grab in Brawl?

As far as I know a well spaced blizzard or an utilt is the easiest ways.
But running "too far" predicting a roll and grab works great too, even if all those is situational. How do you land your grabs?

yeah, im interested in this as well.

does sheild camping work well?

I usually just predict rolls, standing dodges, laggy moves, etc. to land grabs. Blizzard can work, but the other character can often DI out of it or above your grab range.  I also like to get the other character directly above me if possible, since a lot of people will either descend with an aerial and risk getting shield-grabbed or airdodge and then immediately roll or spot dodge, which also leads to an easy grab.  This obviously doesn't work against all characters and people, but I've had success with it nonetheless.

I don't like shield camping as much in Brawl as I did in Melee; since you can no longer wavedash, just sitting there in your shield usually doesn't lead to much against people with good spacing, although sometimes a short hop blizzard OoS after the other character hits your shield with something can work.

yeah fly, the blizzard oos was what i was thinking.

i like to jump at my at op with an air dodge instead of an attack that usally throws them off and leads to a grab, also desynch like get nana to freeze breath and run in with pop also desynch forward b

What's a good way to use the charge foward smash while nana is on ledge trick?

I don't really know any good grab setups in Brawl. Blizzard doesn't work since it just freezes your opponent and hits him into the air. I find myself just shield camping a whole lot waiting for the opponent to eventually space something poorly. You can punish out of shield very well with a jump forward-B or dash-A so you aren't limited at all. You are also very safe and can't be grabbed. People used to be scared of grabbing ICs in Melee for some reason but you could rarely punish it. Throws gave characters weird invincibility frames (that's what it seemed like) and if Nana broke you out it was just luck most of the time. In Brawl though, it's way easier to input a command to Nana which will break you out.

I'm a very non-grab dependent ICs player though, so my strategy of not focusing on grabs will probably not work for most ICs players.



Get near the edge then run backwards and pivot an f-smash. Then just keep holding forward and A. Nana will dash-A and then walk off the ledge while Popo will be charging an f-smash. If Nana does f-smash instead of dash-A, you pressed A too soon.

The f-smash isn't that important though. What really matters is having Nana on the edge. People lose the ability to sweetspot and you can shield the up-B while Nana rolls back on, then grab, and finish the opponent off.

What is a good counter pick stage for Ice Climbers?

That's a fancy trick...I may have to learn that one.

I actually have trouble getting the kill.  I can rack up damage well enough, but can't KO worth crud.  I think I might be to obvious in my approaches when the %s get high.

What're some effective ways to get the kill?

(I'll be going to a tourny this and next Saturday, I'll see if I can't get a vid or something.)

I usually KO with usmash & fsmash. Some people still fall for P fthrow -> N fair spike off the edge, so it's good to keep that option in mind. Also, if you're opponent is above you and you're really confident that s/he isn't going to airdodge, you can belay for KOs at lower percentages. dtilt and ftilt work pretty well on some characters, too.

Regarding stage counterpicks, I pretty much always pick neutral-ish stages, since weird-*** levels screw with the ICs for pretty much the same reasons they did in Melee.  I personally am partial to Smashville and FD, although that's probably just because I'm more familiar with them than any other levels.

I posted up an IC tutorial. It should clear a lot of stuff up.

Anyone got any good uses for the final smash? Nintendo is holding a official 3stock single elemination brawltournament with only startchars, and all startstages on random but the custom stages.
I have only found out that it´s great on like skyworld, were you can destroy the platforms forcing the opponent to take damage. Grabspam works nice too...

Do either of these work or is it easy to escape from?

(both at the edge)

P down throw -> P Fsmash -> N fair (so opponent is caught in the Fsmash and before they get hit away by the Fsmash they get hit by N fair.)
P down throw -> N fair -> P footstool

Would you mind elaborating on some of the things in your playstyle? I'm considering maining the Ice Climbers but I don't want to pick a character that is over reliant on grabs.

Jartravious, you may want to read my guide. It's stickied. The only complaints I've received are a lack of info on chaingrabs. And no pretty pictures. ^_^

Seiken the F-smash/F-air might work, but why not just Fair with Nana out of the grab?

What are other moves besides the specials and smashes to use while desynced?

Well my friend plays Ike and whenever I play ICs and I'm near the edge he expects the straight forward Nana fair. So at low percentages he always uses his Bup in time since he knows what I'm going to do. I'm just guessing that Fsmash/fair might mess up his timing although I'm not sure if he can use his Bup before the Fsmash or between the Fsmash and fair. I haven't played him in a while so I'll have to test it against him next time I play.

Alright will do

easiest way i start out my grabs is play defensive, make them come to you and just shield grab and punish em. in some situations this doesnt work tho, for example if falco fsmash does knockback even when you shield it and pushes you away so you wont be able to grab, in that case use mind games and dash/shield grab.